Memories of Be Forever are accompanied by fans’ “box seat shouts”

Ishizu: I didn’t actually watch Yamato III in real time. I was a student in a dormitory at the time of broadcast, so I didn’t have a TV in my room. (Laughs) I did see Be Forever at the theater. When the person I went with spotted Yoshinori Kanada’s scenes, he shouted at the screen, KANADA!! (Everyone laughs) I still remember going to see it with those people and being overwhelmed. (Laughs) It was a time when people who were passionate about art were beginning to emerge.

Akitaka: I saw Be Forever and Yamato III when I was a freshman in high school. The first Mobile Suit Gundam was in 1979. Be Forever was the following year, so I remember it well.

Ishizu: So you and I are 3 years apart. I was in my third year of high school when Gundam was released. At that time, Yamato came first, then Gundam, then another Yamato, and then another Gundam, and so on.

Akitaka: That was the case at that time. The appearance of Gundam did change the color of Yamato a bit, but when Yamato came out, there was always some kind of action.

Ishizu: Yes, there was. I didn’t watch the broadcast of Yamato III, but I saw the designs. I think I checked them out in anime magazines, so I guess I was still curious about it.

Yamato mecha gained more precision in response to the trend of the 80s

Interviewer: First of all, please tell us about your impression of Be Forever.

Akitaka: I remember being surprised by Sasha’s existence. I was like, “You made her 16 years old?” (Laughs)

Ishizu: I think I was more surprised by the concepts than by the character herself. I was only watching the mecha, so I didn’t have a strong impression of the characters. (Laughs) I feel that Katsumi Itabashi’s design line was an extension of various things from the late 70’s to the 80’s. I was wondering if he was following in the footsteps of overseas SF artists such as Chris Foss, whose books were also published in Japan at the time. I was looking at Itabashi-san’s designs.

Art by Chris Foss

Bolar mecha designs by Katsumi Itabashi

Akitaka: In terms of the film itself, Be Forever is my favorite Yamato film. From the very beginning, the person who made a scene decided, “Here’s what I’m going to do next! How about that?” It’s like a roller coaster movie. You can’t take your eyes off the screen while watching it. If I may say so, for me the drama between the captured Yuki and Ensign Alphon was like getting a break to take a breath. (Laughs)

My impression of Be Forever is that the action scenes are a series of climaxes. Compared to the previous series, Yamato‘s drawings were more precise in Be Forever, weren’t they?

Ishizu: That was possible because it was made for the theater.

Akitaka: I was very impressed by the new Yamato designs. In Be Forever, Yamato is very sharp. Until then, the drawings had been unstable from work to work. But from Be Forever onward, it became more determined. That’s why I have a deep impression that the drawings in Yamato III are also very solid.

The good old days when the “3x rule” was accepted and loved

Interviewer: In Be Forever, a lot of new mecha and equipment for Yamato was released. What did you pay attention to?

Akitaka: Yamato‘s equipment is just as we saw in the movie. I was impressed by the explanation of the omnidirectional navigation radar. I didn’t know it could be done like that. The only other major changes in Yamato‘s remodeling were the “supercharger” and the addition of the anchor mark and the war stripes.

Ishizu: From around that time, I started to have a greater sense of “where is this?” It was getting bigger. Before that, most of the drawings were just images.

Akitaka: It was like, “The size on the diagram and the size of the interior are different!” The inside of the ship was about three times larger.

Ishizu: (Laughs)

Akitaka: Since then, it’s been called the “3x rule.” One famous example is the floor grid of the first bridge, which is 1 meter on a side, and the story goes that it was doubled. Nowadays, we draw in 3D, and what doesn’t fit doesn’t fit, so in some cases, we have to lie on the screen. But since 2199, we’ve tried to make it look as if it would fit. As I recall, Yutaka Izubuchi also made the design of the bridge smaller, didn’t he?

Ishizu: Not smaller, but in real scale. We made it by calculating whether it would actually fit or not. We took the opportunity to do that. Knowing how it was thought about in those days, I don’t know if it was better in the past or now.

The Influence of Yutaka Izubuchi and Katsumi Itabashi

Interviewer: I’d like to talk about the mechanics of Yamato III. Mr. Ishizu, you didn’t watch it in real time, did you?

Ishizu: Hideki Oka told me, “Please watch it!” So I finally gave it a proper watch. (Laughs)

Akitaka: I bought the DVD box around the time I finished my work on 2205.

Ishizu: Once you start watching it, it is quite interesting, isn’t it?

Akitaka: Especially up to the 11th episode. Things start to get a little strange from there. (Laughs)

Ishizu: Was that about the Galman Wolf?

Akitaka: That came later, from Episode 14 onward.

Ishizu: Looking at it again, I feel that Yamato III is strongly influenced by Mr. Izubuchi’s taste. You see a scientist (Frausky, a technical officer) in it. I asked Mr. Izubuchi, “Did you design that medal?” He said, “Not me.” Then I wondered who it was. (Laughs)

Interviewer: Mr. Akitaka, you watched it in real time back then, didn’t you?

Akitaka: I watched it, but I don’t remember most of it. I saw it only once at the time. I thought Kanada-san and his team’s drawings were amazing. That’s all I was following.

Ishizu: When I looked at it again, I realized that the ships were drawn much better than I had expected. Surprisingly, I liked the Twin Three-deck Carrier. (Laughs) I think the organization of the Dagon fleet is fascinating.

Akitaka: I don’t know about the “landing on the right and departing on the left” thing, but it’s fine.

Interviewer: Looking back, the design was in line with the trends of the time, but it’s a bit different from the Yamato of the past, isn’t it? Would you say it was a modern style of the time?

Ishizu: Yes. It’s true that the design of the 60’s flowed into the design of the late 70’s.

Akitaka: The first Yamato was a groundbreaking design at the time.

Ishizu: In the first Gamilas designs you can feel the influence of the Stingray from The Great Undersea War Stingray (1964/UK), and the Black Shark from Latitude Zero (1969/Toho). I felt that Itabashi-san’s work had the taste of overseas SF paintings by Chris Foss and others. The SF boom at that time brought a lot of SF paintings into Japan, and I think that was a big influence.

Akitaka: Be Forever is very much influenced by SF art of the 70s and 80s, isn’t it?

Ishizu: The same goes for the intermediate supply base and so on. I saw an image similar to that in an illustration at the time. I may be remembering it wrong.

Mecha created by staff who are “passionate about Yamato“

Interviewer: Speaking of Yamato III, there is also the now-legendary Battleship Arizona, designed by Yutaka Izubuchi.

Ishizu: I like the design of the ships, even though those from other nations don’t appear in many scenes. It’s interesting that it has the same shape as Yamato, but appears as something different. Itabashi’s Battleship Bismarck is also interesting. I think it would have been interesting to see a little more of the various Earth ships. In the end, they only play a minor role.

Akitaka: The Battleship Novik is especially impressive because it’s a vertical-lift type ship.

Ishizu: You can’t help but be curious about it, can you? (Laughs)

Akitaka: In Yamato III, Domon’s parents take a ride in the beginning. The “Solar Sightseeing Boat” they’re on is also a vertical-lift type.

Ishizu: I wonder why that was. At that time, I didn’t understand the rules for differentiating why they chose a vertical lift-off type.

Akitaka: Could it be because it’s a private ship?

Ishizu: Maybe.

Akitaka: They have the technology to control gravity, and are able to break through the atmosphere, but for some reason they chose the vertical ascent type, didn’t they? That’s kind of interesting. Another memorable mecha is the “Hydro Cosmogen Cannon.” It was quite a shock to see that one.

Ishizu: The “new Dessler ship” that appeared at the end was really big. (Laughs) In the last scene, Dessler comes alongside Yamato, and I thought, “Wow!”

Interviewer: The size is large, but it doesn’t have much detail compared to Yamato. I feel that it looks monotonous.

Ishizu: I think it was well thought out for that time period. It must have been done by people who were passionate about Yamato at that time.

If we were to redesign the mecha of Be Forever and Yamato III…

Interviewer: As for 3199, there has been no official announcement by the staff yet, but if you were to redesign the mecha of Be Forever and Yamato III, what would you like to try?

Ishizu: This is in a different category, but I’d like to design the Galman-Garmillas city.

Interviewer: In Yamato III, Itabashi’s design touch was included in the Gamilas team’s design, wasn’t it? I’m very interested in how you’d handle it.

Akitaka: In 2205, both Tamamori-san and I touched on the mecha designed by Itabashi-san. We each have different ways of interpreting Itabashi mecha, so I’m sure it will be interesting.

Ishizu: If 3199 includes the story of Yamato III, I’m looking forward to seeing how Arizona will turn out.

Interviewer: Arizona is really loved by old Yamato fans, isn’t it?

Akitaka: I think the reason for its popularity is that it’s evolved from Andromeda. At that time, the existence of Andromeda had a strong impact.

Ishizu: Mr. Tamamori’s Andromeda, when seen from the front, looks like a “badass” when seen from the front.

Interviewer: By the way, Mr. Akitaka, Hideki Oka said that you’re particular about Bolar.

Akitaka: I heard that Oka-san and Fukui-san said so at a Yamatalk. But what I’m particular about is the Dark Nebula Empire! So I’ll correct that here. In short, I definitely want to design the “Sweep-up Tripod Tank!” That’s what I meant. (Laughs)

Interviewer: When I look at the multi-legged tank you designed in 2205, I can understand how you feel. (Laughs)

Ishizu: Talking about 2205, I was allowed to create a lot of strange spaceships. It was fun. I rarely got to draw unarmed Garmillas ships. (Laughs)

Akitaka: Like the “hospital ship” that appeared in the original work, for example. At the time of production, I heard that Mr. Ishizu was going to draw a hospital ship, and it was a topic of conversation among the staff.

Ishizu: The hospital ship left an impression on me, and I really wanted to include it in the film. (Laughs) Come to think of it, the captain’s seat of Pleiades in 2205 had a great design, didn’t it?

Akitaka: Director Yasuda gave me a rough idea for that design, saying, “I want it to look like this.” I was like, “I want to create a visual with this kind of atmosphere for the scene.”

Ishizu: That’s right.

The bridge of the Great Pleiades of the Dezarium Army, led by Deda. A passageway leading to
Deda’s private quarters can be seen behind his command chair positioned in the center.

Akitaka: Come to think of it, I was originally supposed to design the room where Deda meditates. But in the end, it was only the passage coming out from behind the captain’s seat.

Ishizu: It was cool to see the red ships lined up on the dark screen.

Akitaka: I don’t know why, but I have that kind of image in my mind. Xevious is another example.

Ishizu: Ah, it might be a generational thing. Was it designated as such?

Akitaka: When I submitted the image of the bridge from the beginning, I put in specific colors and proposed, “This is the way I want to do it.”

Ishizu: That scene left a strong impression on me. Garmillas, on the other hand, is designed in a straightforward manner. (Laughs) I think it’s good to have contrast in the work. The newly-emerged “Dezarium” should have a different impression from Garmillas.

Yamato‘s unique appeal in terms of “steering scenes”

Akitaka: How is a Dezarium ship steered? It seemed that no detailed concept had been devised, so I proposed a design that would make it look like there were almost no people on board.

Ishizu: It is true that there was no depiction of steering a ship. Gamilas ships are properly steered, but I’m not sure if they’re steered from a helm. I don’t really know. I guess there are various ways to move a ship in the original series. It’s easier to turn if steering is directed from a helm. That’s all there is to it, after all.

Akitaka: The ships in Legend of the Galactic Heroes, Die Neue These are operated with left and right control sticks. The reason it still works is that there are almost no scenes in which the ship is operated, even in the previous works. Even when you see the commander’s console.

Ishizu: The direction of a space battleship is inevitably like that, isn’t it? It’s a way of showing the commander.

CG layout of Yamato‘s first bridge. Since the seats have been removed, it can be confirmed
that the scale and size of the bridge is considerably reduced from the original version.

Akitaka: Yamato is rather special. The main stage of the story is the first bridge. So, for example, when Shima is operating the helm with all his strength, it creates a sense of tension on the stage.

Ishizu: Indeed. Yamato‘s first bridge is well designed. I’ve never seen such a well-designed setting for a story. Yamato was probably the first.

Akitaka: Actually, Yamato is the only one.

Ishizu: In hindsight, bridges in the Star Trek series are also well designed, but the first impact was made by Yamato.

Interviewer: In the Star Trek series, ship operation is done only by operating a panel by hand, avoiding specific expressions.

Ishizu: In the case of Enterprise, the seating arrangement on the bridge is not directly in front, it’s about 30 degrees off. The doorways are in the back so a person can be seen entering. The design is derived from the camera angle.

Akitaka: There aren’t many scenes of operating a large ship in other visual works. There are only Gundam‘s White Base and Nadesico‘s mobile battleship. Those are basically like Yamato, right?

Ishizu: It is Yamato. Even now, bridge designs are more about mecha design than art in terms of function.

Akitaka: There aren’t many artists who are willing to work on mecha design, especially these days. A bridge is a very high-calorie job. (Laughs)

Ishizu: That’s right. I did a lot of drawings for 2205, but…

Akitaka: In 2205, the favorite part of the job came after the design was finished…

Ishizu: There was plenty of work. (Laughs) Czvarke‘s cockpit took a lot of work. In that case, I thought it would have been better to prepare CG in advance.

Akitaka: Mr. Ishizu was really amazing. Especially his design for the Deusula III.

Ishizu: I felt like I was drawing endlessly. (Laughs)

Akitaka: You even added your own special effects, didn’t you?

The spirit of, “It’s Yamato, so that’s the way it is” supports the passion for design

Interviewer: Do you use CG in your design work?

Ishizu: Yes. At the time of 2199, I only did designs as drawings. I think it was the same with 2202. Then, for 2205, they started asking me, “Can you prepare a pass [flyby] as well?” It was very difficult to prepare consistent passes and drawings. That’s why I started to incorporate CG.

Akitaka: These days, Mr. Ishizu first creates a 3D drawing and then extract lines from there. Deusula III was also done in CG from a very early stage.

Ishizu: That was pretty early. The width of the deck was much narrower when we first made it.

Akitaka: Did you widen it?

Ishizu: The Dessler gun didn’t fit. (Laughs) Even if it did, it would be like a thin stick, so I thought it would be difficult if I didn’t make it wider. It was widened to be about the same as the current aircraft carrier, George Washington.

Interviewer: So, in the end, both of you are doing very high-calorie work, aren’t you? Is that because it’s Yamato?

Akitaka: Yes, that’s right.

Ishizu: From the time of 2199, staff members were all saying, “It’s Yamato, so that’s the way it is.” We all came to that conclusion. I think that’s how we both ended up here. (Laughs)

Deusula III, simple 3DCG modeling by Yasushi Ishizu. Blender is used for modeling. The number of polygons is suppressed, so the geometry is rough, but this model was used to arrange the armaments on the deck for size comparison with the Dessler gun. This is reflected in the design drafts.